Devon 4x4 - the 4x4 experts

I've been competing with a discovery for a few years. It has evolved from this

disco with a 300tdi
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to this still with the 300 tdi
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to this with a rover v8
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But since then we had loads of problems with the v8 so we would like to go back to a diesel but still have some proper powerr.

So the options are:

TD5
pros : Good power, very available, lots of aftermarket goodies
cons: electronics (don't know a lot about this (yet)
BMW 6 cilinder 2,8
pros: Very good power, no computer, lots of them availabl, little bit lighter then TD5
cons: some mods needed for offroading, not so much used, so spare more of a problem at international events.
Or......

All will be coupled to a uprated ZF gearbox with the compushift.

Goal is to have a competitive car for local challenges but also for foreign ones like Croatia.

Please give your opinion/discuss.

Cheers Bowy

Td5 gets my vote.

Your reasons above are very valid, but if you're going to do the likes of croatia, you won't find any bmw spares kicking around; you will however find plenty of td5 stuff.

Ross

It will depend on your budget.

Td5 is a good option, however rover v8 or gm ls engines will provide more power = better driving experience.

It will also depend on you mechanical ability and again your service budget. If you go for more power you will be replacing drivetrain componants more frequently.

landcruiser engine no spares needed !!!

jerry h wrote: I think that'll be our next engine. 4.2TD

BMW M57 6 cylinder 3.o liter diesel. Good enough for Rally Raid UK to use on the Dakar. Loads of tourque.

Job Done

Enlighten us on what problems you have had with the V8?

yeah whats gone so wrong for you and the v8, i know when there bad there bad but when you get a good one running well they are hard to beat.

what problems have u had with the v8? do u have any more pics of it in its secongd guise it looks fab frm the frnt end

The problem with the V8 was the side slope usage. For the challenges in Holland it is not uncommon to be on it's side winching for quite some time, and then it starts ticking from oil starvation. Also we had some water misfire problems.

So that's the reason we are looking at diesels again.

@ Breg90: Any tips were to look for information about this engine? specs? ECU or not? conversion tips?

@ landcruiser fan's this crossed our mind, but the engine is probably a tad heavy, we aim at 1800 kg ready to race.

@Chris, LS is a nice option, but sadly our budget doesn't strech that far yet.

i was thinking landcruiser kzj 3.0 turbo diesel 4 cylinder alloy head v powerful & reliable. frobably the same weight as a 200tdi.

"and then it starts ticking from oil starvation."

Yeh, but you get some warning you're pushing your luck.
Diesel is just going to disintergrate with lack of oil (especially turbo)

Dry sump sump is what you need



Scavenge pumps is what bulldozers do

Breg90 wrote:
i agree with this my 335d is running 400bhp and 730 nm of tourque !!!

At least a V8 won't run away on it's own oil when oil gets in the wrong place when on it's side.
And water problems can be solved as well with MegaSquirt.

I would not use a normal car engine, I seem to remember when Land Rover took the Ford Transit engine they modified it to work better when at angles and make sure all their engine are happier at angles. I'm not sure if other 4x4 manufacturers do this but I would not expect somebody like BMW to make sure their engines work at extreme angles.

So that's the reason we are looking at diesels again.

@ Breg90: Any tips were to look for information about this engine? specs? ECU or not? conversion tips?

Hi,

Search for BMW M57 on google, your looking for the followiung web site:

www.bmwheaven.com/database/engine.php?type=M57#/101

Lets you pick the engine variant and it tells you the vehicles it was fitted to.

In short, BMW 330d, 530d, X-5 and L332 rangey.

The following info was valid when I bought my engine in late 2009, sadly not got it running.... work in progress.

The cheap ECU fix is to get an earlier pre 2004 unit. This was the simpler ECU (known as DDE4 ECU) that only comunicates with the security unit and the key fob. Jerermy Fearn can stop it looking for the key for about £150. Just make sure you get the engine loom and injector loom, throttle pedal, ECU and SWS security unit with the engine. If it comes form a rangey it will have a loom that is 12 " longer than the car unit. However not long enough to put ECU high up in cab.

Then you need an air flow meter housing out of a vauxhall omega straight 6, 2.5 liter, diesel. It has a round housing, the BMW unit has an oval housing that is a bugger to fit hoses onto. The BMW airflow meter fits into the Vauxhaul round airflow meter housing. The vauxhaul air flow meter will not suit the BMW engine, so you need to find a car at the scrappies to get the housing to avoid having to buying the full unit from vauxhall with an airflow meter you can't use....

You need to get an adaptor to connect hoses to the inlet manifold. J Fearn does one, or make one if your handy with a lathe.

Apparently a TD5 rad and intercooler (thick version) will get you running.

This gives you 184 HP and 410Nm at 2000 rpm.

This unit can be tuned upto 250 HP i am informed. More is possible by fitting 2 of TD4 turbos in paraellel in place of the single BMW unit.

Later engines need fancier ECU's. Options then are then Simtec or Rally Raid UK. Rally Raid UK can get the latest twin turbo 286 HP 580 Nm at 1750 rpm engines to work. BUT their pricing is aimed at those that can afford to do the dakar.... They also do some nifty software for your mobile that allows you to data log the engine parameters, read and clear fault codes etc. You need to be sat down when he advises how much a years rental for the software is......

Engine oiling - I have not yet run the engine. However I have looked at this. The rangey sump has a drive shaft through it, so is no use. The car sump is designed for nice level flat roads.... I looked at the sump that LR put on the P38 2.5 liter verison of the same engine. It is much wider and obviuosly has more oil capacity. I am aiming to fit the P38 sump to the BMW engine to get the smae sump design that LR engineered for side slopes etc, I have the sump and a siezed 2nd engine to test this on, but not actually done this yet....

After all that you need a gearbox. A R380 from a P38 2.5 liter rangey will bolt up I believe. However I understand that the engine spits a R380 out in no time and everyone that goes down this route regrets it. I spent up on the Tremec TKO from Rakeway. Again take a seat when you ask for the price and don't tell the missus.

Adrian